I need to reiterate for people who are waffling on whether they’re going to leave the US next year it is not easy.

Lesley Carhart :unverified:

It’s taken friends and professional contacts in country to advise and reference me. Even so the simple fact that I’m 41 will cost me thousands more dollars and a lot of stress. I’m not saying you can’t do it. There are avenues other than skilled work.

Lesley Carhart :unverified:

It’s taken me being of a certain age (most countries cut off at 45 for skilled work). It’s taken thousands and thousands of dollars in legal fees and moving fees. It’s taking me having an employer in that country to sponsor me.

Lesley Carhart :unverified:

Let’s talk about what it’s taken for me. First of all, it’s taken time - visas take a long time to process in most countries - months or even years. It’s also taken me having proven skill set in an in demand field. It’s taking me being in decent health.

Lesley Carhart :unverified:

What I’m saying is don’t just talk. Have a plan - research that plan and find out what’s actually possible. Don’t assume you can’t immigrate and don’t assume you can without tons of work. Don’t assume it will happen quickly - prepare now.

Lesley Carhart :unverified:

However, all of these things have the same thing in common: time, money, and a lot of planning. You can’t just decide to move to Canada if you’re not a Canadian same with any country people are talking about going to legally.

Lesley Carhart :unverified:

There are digital nomad visas. There are apprenticeship programs for in demand repair skills in several countries. There are countries where you can open a business with a substantial investment, but nothing insane.

Fi, infosec-aspected 🏳️‍⚧️

@hacks4pancakes

It's entirely out of reach for a lot of us. I don't get to have the option.

Lazarou Monkey Terror 🚀💙🌈

@munin @hacks4pancakes people have no idea how trapped they really are, it's fucked

Lesley Carhart :unverified:

@Lazarou @munin there are options out there but you have to be flexible and do a lot of research.

Mr. E. Grey Seale

@hacks4pancakes
Remember kids every country is having a housing crisis.

Lesley Carhart :unverified:

@geichel it does depend on how rural you’re willing to be and work, though. Some countries are more amenable to people fixing up houses in the country.

Esther Payne :bisexual_flag:

@hacks4pancakes @Lazarou @munin Timing matters so much for this. We moved before just before the Brexit vote to France, we also timed our application for Article 50 residency really carefully. We sacrificed a lot.

It does take time, patience and money. The earlier you plan and start the better.

Patrick Lam :tinoflag:

@onepict @hacks4pancakes @Lazarou @munin or luck, but it's hard to plan on that. I got lucky twice: with my parents moving to Canada before I was born, and with my spouse being in NZ on a work visa in 2022 (though that was also in part planned based on a hunch)

Esther Payne :bisexual_flag:

@va2lam @hacks4pancakes @Lazarou @munin Indeed some luck does play into it. Luck of circumstances.

Although I do find myself a little irritated when friends say "you're so lucky", when I structured my life to work from home, not have a financial safety net or family nearby.

Some of the luck is from seeing that I could leave and doing it. I think sometimes luck is knowing you are open to an opportunity, so you know to grasp it when you see it.

Fi, infosec-aspected 🏳️‍⚧️

@onepict @va2lam @hacks4pancakes @Lazarou

Kind of off topic, but I've been coming around to the notion that luck is a skill, and one you can practice -

not so much that events will necessarily happen in your favor of themselves,

but that by cultivating opportunities for wins - like how you mention, structuring your life to enable certain kinds of work - then you'll be able to take advantage of events when they do show up.

Esther Payne :bisexual_flag:

@munin @va2lam @hacks4pancakes @Lazarou I think there is something to that. I've found that over the years knowing what I want means I see the door open.

When I've been closed off and confused about what I want I miss out.

I also think about Karma, like if you're awful to people they won't soften your fall. But conversely if you try to help folks then if they see a way to help you they will. Plus I think it's a better state of mind to be spreading help around. More eyes to see the doors

Esther Payne :bisexual_flag:

@munin @va2lam @hacks4pancakes @Lazarou But to be honest, I've always loved being able to help out others quietly.

When you can help someone out and make a difference it's a little bit like putting pixie dust out into the world.

Fi, infosec-aspected 🏳️‍⚧️

@onepict @va2lam @hacks4pancakes @Lazarou

heh, for me, I just like being a cryptid - someone who shows up out of nowhere, helps out, and vanishes.

Esther Payne :bisexual_flag:

@munin

Ah ha!

Reminds me of this stanza by Dorothy Parker. It's one of my favourite poems.

"I am sister to the rain;
Fey and sudden and unholy,
Petulant at the windowpane,
Quickly lost, remembered slowly."

Rainy Night

Rainy Night - Ghosts of all my lovely sins

Poets.org (poets.org)

Patrick Lam :tinoflag:

@onepict @hacks4pancakes @Lazarou @munin Yeah. So clearly I had no say in where my parents immigrated to, but for getting the NZ resident visa, I had the privilege to be able to follow the trends and guess to how it might go, so that we got the super streamlined resident visas.