This is the thing.

Erin Kissane

@Dubikan That is not at all what I am saying, though. Read the whole thread? It's only a few posts long.

blaine

@jdp23 @kissane I thought about including WEBP, but we all know people who use WEBP are shills for Google. I also thought about bringing GIF into the debate, but I knew it would descend into a /ɡɪf/ vs /dʒɪf/ fight, and no-one wants that in 2024.

Dubi is here :Dambo8:

@kissane you're right, but there's a bit of a contradiction between how you state the problem in the first post, and the solution you propose, isn't there? Maybe I'm missing something

Ivy [_gay] Mae :fire_trans:

@kissane I've actually had a few irl friends try out the fedi recently and its been quite interesting to see just how much of a difference having someone actually guide them and get them set up helps

the empty timeline when you start is super duper intimidating and honestly without someone guiding them and recommending people for them to follow it would've been almost impossible for them to actually get situated here

Evan Prodromou

@kissane Is it really either-or?

Is the energy spent pointing out that venture-funded startups might not be working for the good of society as a whole actually transferrable to other work?

I think we can do both: talk about the superiority of open protocols as a societal good and also build great software and social experiences.

These enclosure startups want to frame the debate around UI. We need to keep it focused on governance.

Evan Prodromou

@kissane the fact that people from these venture-funded startups complain like a soccer player faking an injury any time someone replies to them on governance is a good sign that the criticism is very effective.

I don't intend to give up that effective tool unilaterally.

Evan Prodromou

@blaine @kissane @polotek it's not about the technology. That's a smokescreen.

Folks from these startups are trying to frame their efforts at enclosing the commons as a technology difference. So and so proprietary protocol is soooo much better than the open standard.

But it's not about the tech; it's about governance. VCs are betting their investment companies can sweep the board and own the entire ecosystem. That's how venture capital works.

Evan Prodromou

@blaine @kissane @polotek The fediverse has a different vision. There are over 100 known implementers of ActivityPub. Nobody is in charge; the technology is open and unpatented. Anyone can play.

That's not about bits on the wire; it's about people, social interaction, and frankly about control.

Evan Prodromou

@blaine @kissane @polotek our vision is better. Everyone gets to win -- not just a few series A funds on Sand Hill Road. That's why I'm going to keep fighting for it.

Evan Prodromou

@kissane Threads added 75 million new monthly active users since July 2024. The bulk of the people are actually on *this* network that we're using right now.

Evan Prodromou

@blaine @kissane @polotek one thing I do like is seeing hundreds of millions of dollars going into distributed social networking. It's unfortunate that it's done in that winner-take-all VC game, but it's a good signal.

Gytis Repečka

@evan @kissane Dear Evan, what do you think - should small instances choose to block Threads, or instead give it a chance, considering how many people are arriving? :blobcatthinkowo:

Evan Prodromou

@kissane startups have good marketing -- especially when they're trying to raise money. "Everyone is coming to our network" is marketing.

Evan Prodromou

@gytisrepecka @kissane I think small instances should exercise the control they have through open protocols to make that decision for themselves.

I strongly support the Fedipact, even though our coop isn't part of it. I'm so glad Fediverse instances can exercise that control.

Fediverse Report

@kissane

Mx Verda

@blaine @jdp23 @kissane

It’s Jeff, not Jiff !

GunChleoc

@MxVerda @blaine @jdp23 @kissane We're on the Fedi, so it's actually Yiff.

Erin Kissane

@evan So technically, there is a question mark in your reply but given that the rest is declarative, it’s not my sense that you’re actually asking for my assessment of your specific communication choices.

Do let me know if I’m wrong, but I’m not going to offer that kind of advice without an invitation—to you or to anyone else. (I can’t prevent anyone from reading general statements as being about them as individuals, but that’s not what I’m doing.)

Erin Kissane

@Dubikan I don't see a contradiction, but maybe I'm not being clear enough. The fediverse's architectural benefits alone are never going to be enough to get most people to switch to it. Most non-tech people are never going to care!

So fedi either builds itself to be easier and more pleasant to use to make itself more attractive to those people, or it loses most of them to easier and more pleasant networks. Which means fewer sociable people will find their friends here, which is a bad cycle.

Erin Kissane

@evan So let's be real: When someone says "everyone," they mean "my friends and names I know in my communities." That's happened with *my* friends and the names I know in my science and literature communities—some are here, most are now on Bluesky. (Many left Twitter, tried Mastodon, found it deeply unpleasant, and moved to Bluesky.)

There are obviously multiple forces in play, but I think people do know where their friends are.