Chats are now federating as limited-visibility posts on the fediverse
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It would be nice if Direct Messages (DMs) or Private Messages (PMs) were treated like email and only sent to the people you are sending it to.
But generally, on most platforms, if you mention someone in the top level post, they are assumed to be on the recipient list. (Note, some platforms, like Mastodon, treat every post as if it were a top level post.)
Hubzilla has more privacy features, which prevents your messages from leaking to others, but part of that is because we use the Zot protocol between Hubzilla instances, and can set privacy at the thread level (i.e. the permissions of the top level post is the permissions for the entire thread).
When the same conversation is sent via ActivityPub, we lose a lot of control over the privacy of that post. We can and do address it to specific recipients, but other platforms don't have the same types of access controls, which means we can't enforce the access control list for that conversation on those platforms. -
Seems to work! WHy did you think it didn't?
EDIT: oh wait, this is actually an unlisted post, it didn't work, I was confused. I'll try from a mastodon account.
@[email protected] -
@[email protected] no, no, i just edited my post, I was confused ... in fact it wasn't working, I'll try from a Mastodon account
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Speaking of the principle of least surprise ... @jdp23 is post got auto-boosted by @activitypub but there wasn't anything that indicated to me that was going to happen.
And, from GoToSocial, the topic's subject shows up nicely from Julian, @jdp23's reply lost the topic, but it showed back up in Julian's reply to the (topicless) reply ... Behavior's similar on Sharkey, although the subject doesn't render as nicely (but it's still readable)
With the @thenexusofprivacy account on Glitch, the subjects don't show up at all -- not even in Julian's original post.
@stefan @julian -
The Nexus of Privacyreplied to The Nexus of Privacy on last edited by [email protected]
And also speaking of violations of the principle of least surprise: it's interesitng to look at how these posts do and don't show up on the Discourse thread at https://socialhub.activitypub.rocks/t/chats-are-now-federating-as-limited-visibility-posts-on-the-fediverse/4650/15 ...
Julian's posts are all fine, no surprise, but a good sign for Discourse/NodeBB federation.
@jdp23's posts show up twice on that thread.
@nexus 's post didn't show up on that thread. So on average, my posts are getting there one, which is good, but the standard deviation's higher than I'd like.
Now how about this post from Mastodon?
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"I think you ran into this as well?"
I only recall the situation you just described, when I received a mention without being included.
But I have seen others run into similar situations when they just didn't know that tagging people adds them to a group conversation.
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Stefan Bohacekreplied to Stefan Bohacek on last edited by
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Stefan Bohacekreplied to The Nexus of Privacy on last edited by
@thenexusofprivacy @jdp23 @nexus @julian Hah, yeah, seeing mine!
Even though I've been in the fediverse for over a year now, and I'm pretty used to folks from different platforms talking to each other, it's still pretty fascinating to see this between platforms that I don't typically interact with.
Had the same sort of an "aha moment" with Lemmy not too long ago!
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The Nexus of Privacyreplied to Stefan Bohacek on last edited by
Yeah, it's amazing when it works. When I tag a Lemmy community in a pst here and it actually shows up as a thread there, it's very cool.
Unfortunately half the time I tag a Lemmy community it doesn't show up as a post there, and there's never indication way. So it's not always amazing. But still, it's amazing when it works!
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Jupiter Rowlandreplied to Stefan Bohacek on last edited by@Stefan Bohacek @jdp23 @julian "Shadow mentioning" is a thing. (streams) and Forte do it to avoid clutter. Mentions don't have to be visible in a post/comment to work.
