Honestly, if you’re in the US, please vote.
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@gwm @johnstonphilip @benroyce @Mourioche Yet you can't actually form a argument for why it's not like that, can you? You just don't want it to be.
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@gwm @benroyce @Mourioche @WAHa_06x36 @baconandcoconut I completely get why you don't want to vote for a candidate who has enabled genocide. I wouldn't either. It totally sucks.
But the fact is the choice is between someone who has enabled genocide in the middle east, but might possibly do something to rein it in, or someone who will positively support genocide both in the the middle east and in Ukraine.
There is no no-genocide option here. The only question is how many genocides you want.
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@WAHa_06x36 @johnstonphilip @benroyce @Mourioche It's not like that because voting for Jill Stein is not like driving off a cliff. My vote Jill Stein isn't going to kill me (or anyone else).
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@gwm @WAHa_06x36 @johnstonphilip @Mourioche
10 people in a room
4 want genocide
6 do not
they vote
4 vote genocide
3 vote not genocide
3 vote "i am a toxic idealist who expects perfection"
pro-genocide carries the vote and commits it
this analogy represents the only real value of a third party vote in the broken ass american fptp voting system
you are a toxic idealist, harming your own cause
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@statsguy @benroyce @Mourioche @WAHa_06x36 @baconandcoconut There IS a no-genocide option. Her name is Jill Stein. I voted for her.
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Mastodon Migrationreplied to Ben Royce 🇺🇦 last edited by [email protected]
@benroyce @gwm @WAHa_06x36 @johnstonphilip @Mourioche
Understand that people want clarity, and are upset that Harris has not come right out and told them what they want to hear. But, before she can do what they want her to do, she has to win the election first. The nasty reality of electoral politics in the US right now is she is forced to be less than direct because of all the constituencies involved. The point is she can't end the war if she is not elected.
1/2
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Mastodon Migrationreplied to Mastodon Migration last edited by
@benroyce @gwm @WAHa_06x36 @johnstonphilip @Mourioche
But if you are listening, last night in Ann Arbor Michigan Harris gave what may be her most forceful expression yet on her intention to end the war.
"And listen hey, on the subject of Gaza. Hey guys, I hear you. On the subject of Gaza. We all want this war to end as soon as possible. Get the hostages out. I will do everything in my power to make it so."
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Mastodon Migrationreplied to George Maschke last edited by
@gwm @WAHa_06x36 @johnstonphilip @benroyce @Mourioche
Don't sell yourself short. Hypothetically, if your vote for Jill Stein was the difference that elected Trump and changed the US into a fascist state, it could be responsible for the deaths of millions.
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@gwm @statsguy @benroyce @Mourioche @WAHa_06x36 @baconandcoconut If Trump wins and bulldozes what remains of Gaza so his son-in law can build a golf resort it is on you and your ilk brother
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@mrpinkly @statsguy @benroyce @Mourioche @WAHa_06x36 @baconandcoconut If the Democratic Party loses this election, it is because they ran an unpopular candidate and a horrible campaign.
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@gwm @mrpinkly @statsguy @Mourioche @WAHa_06x36 @baconandcoconut
because they can't appeal to toxic idealists who don't know their ass from their elbow?
that's not the democratic party's fault. that's the fault of fools who don't know how their voting system works
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@benroyce @mrpinkly @statsguy @Mourioche @WAHa_06x36 @baconandcoconut Because the Democratic Party lacks the spine to stand against Israel's ongoing genocide of the Palestinians, but instead enthusiastically funds it. And because the Democratic Party has done nothing to raise the minimum wage, or to bring about Medicare for all, or to enact abortion rights into law.
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George, your vote will absolutely kill people if you're in a swing state with a close margin and it swings the vote to Trump. It will kill:
* immigrants
* pregnant people
* LGBTQ people, especially trans kids
* Everyone on the planet, because he'll want to promote more fossil fuel use.You're a toxic idealist and you, and Jill Stein and Ksharma Sawant are all Putin's puppets.
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@ducksauz @WAHa_06x36 @johnstonphilip @benroyce @Mourioche My vote for Jill Stein cannot swing any state to Trump as I would never have cast my vote for Harris because of her support for Israel's genocide of the people of Palestine.
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@mastodonmigration @benroyce @gwm @WAHa_06x36 @johnstonphilip @Mourioche The American system and history doesn't make it easy for *any* US president to change its stance on Israel. I doubt Stein could achieve much different without significant blowback.
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@dan613 @benroyce @gwm @WAHa_06x36 @johnstonphilip @Mourioche
True, but a newly elected president with substantial majorities in both houses of congress would have a lot more options.
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@gooba42 @benroyce @NZedAUS @gwm @WAHa_06x36 @baconandcoconut This. If there is ranked voting, you must have the option to abstain from continuing your list at some point. Even if it's after the first person.
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@whknott @benroyce @NZedAUS @gwm @WAHa_06x36 @baconandcoconut
I don't feel like we're well served by "It's either my way or I'm not going to participate at all" which is what this amounts to.
In a theoretical "3 Trumps vs Harris" match up, I might have a hard time ranking the Trumps but under virtually any other circumstances I would have clear preferences.
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@gooba42 @whknott @benroyce @NZedAUS @gwm @WAHa_06x36 @baconandcoconut
If I understand ranked choice voting, you don't have to vote for all the candidates. Say there are 4 candidates. You can vote for 1, 2, 3, or all of them, or none of them.
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Ben Royce 🇺🇦replied to Thin Crust Tavern Cut last edited by
@GregArcus @gooba42 @whknott @NZedAUS @gwm @WAHa_06x36 @baconandcoconut
exactly
you can use your ranked choice ballot as if you were still in a fptp voting system and just mark "1" next to who you want to vote for
Of course the real power is you also get to mark a "2" for your second choice, that your vote will flow to, if your "1" choice doesn't prevail
Etc., etc. for "3", "4", "5"...
