hmmmmmm...

Asta [AMP]

probably need a charter like "no nazis, no cops, no terfs, no swerfs, no surveillance, no ads, no profit, community only. think co-op but it's just one person right now"

Asta [AMP]

feeling some big "Field of Dreams" energy here ("if you build it, they will come...")

Andrew Helwer

@aud a lot of orgs (for example TLA+ did this) start under larger foundations like Linux or Eclipse or Apache to get around some of the tedium. However I think some (all?) of those have requirements like letters of intent from people for certain levels of funding before they'll allow you in so they don't just have a bunch of dead projects under them. You can see a probably outdated but representative list of projects under the Linux Foundation on wikipedia:

Linux Foundation - Wikipedia

(en.wikipedia.org)

Asta [AMP]

@[email protected] oh, interesting! I wonder if the kind of stuff I'm thinking about would fall under the umbrella of one of these orgs.

I was planning on writing some stuff up... so once I have something written, it might be a good time to poke around and ask some questions.

Asta [AMP]

@[email protected] … there are some… interesting projects here that I would not have expected to be under the Linux foundation.

Asta [AMP]

fuck it, anarchist tech co-op time

https://codeberg.org/commune-op/manifesto

Asta [AMP]

it's not much more than a somewhat informal statement of what I think tech should be doing, at the moment, but I know there are people here who feel the same way. So, here's a place to start talking about it, if you'd like!

It's not a legal document, it's not too specific at the moment, and that's on purpose because I am not a lawyer and I don't want to pretend I am, nor do I want this to be interpreted as iron clad. If you feel we vibe and are interested, let's... think about stuff we want to do together, yeah? I wanna stop just complaining and do something good.

frank :anarchy_bi: (he / they)

@aud i can't recall if we've talked about this concept of mine or not here, but maybe this could be something worth drawing inspiration from?

The LACROSSE Philosophy: A Pitch for A New Paradigm

Going Beyond 'FLOSS', 'LACROSSE' is a framework for social endeavors

(byfrankmorrow.xyz)

Asta [AMP]

@[email protected] oh, I LOVE this. We haven’t talked about it before, but this is exactly what I’m thinking (and talking) about, too! Plus it’s eloquently stated here, as well.

I really like this.

frank :anarchy_bi: (he / they)

@aud ah, ty—i appreciate that! and it's fab to hear it resonated with your line of thinking recently

i added a little shape to it around the time i published that, if that helps, but i dunno if it holds up as well as the concept itself anymore…

The LACROSSE Philosophy: The Why

An explainer to add shape & context to The LACROSSE Philosophy

(byfrankmorrow.xyz)

Asta [AMP]

@[email protected] So I ended up having to go to the vet for hours and hours last night and it wasn't really possible for me to dig in too much, but... I really like the distinction you make between FLOSS and what you're suggesting here.

Because FLOSS isn't bad, certain actors and industry capture aside, it's good. But I think the idea that it does not go far enough is really solid. Yes, things should be open! And they should be more, too. Like when a maintainer has power over a project, especially an influential one, it's easy to see how unless their values align with the minority groups (which yeah, never happens) then they can all too easy flex power and just never get those needs met. Or the type of "rewrite a PR in my own code and merge that" shit that seems common in both open source and industry.

Asta [AMP]

@[email protected] thinking about this more (the idea of FLOSS not going far enough), I feel like you can sort of easily prove the reverse (do FOSS/FLOSS go far enough?) by simply pointing out that if “open source” by itself was the only necessary requirement, then Mullenweg wouldn’t be able to burn down Wordpress. It’s not just the source; you have the networks, both interpersonal and software (who maintains the software? Who is in charge? Who gets along with whom? Are they working together for a common goal? Does the code rely on infrastructure, like a plugin server? Who owns that server? What other dependencies exist? Is there necessary knowledge that isn’t written down but shared? Is creating a new server or instance too difficult and so helps create inertia for the existing systems?)

God. I feel like we need more people like @[email protected] in general; the psychology of how these projects remain under control of a few select individuals (for them to burn or earn) despite being freely fork-able is… definitely interesting.