USING THE F WORD (RE: TRUMP)

William Lindsey :toad:

@beingreal "The problem 'the left' has is that it encompasses dozens of causes and millions of ideas."

That's right. The coalition of the left is a sprawling, big-tent coalition, and with such a coalition, it's hard to impose the lockstep conformity and obedience that obtain on the right. I also think that the left does itself no favor when it uses those same tactics to try to establish purist tests to rule some of us out and others in, on the basis of matters that shouldn't count so much.

William Lindsey :toad:

@darwinwoodka I think so, myself.

William Lindsey :toad:

@philip_cardella @DoesntExist I thought of this a lot with Brexit, since as an outsider and from a distance, I could see so clearly that the UK was shooting itself in the foot in many ways by enacting Brexit. I was also baffled at many friends who wanted to tell me this was a leftist blow against neoliberal tyranny, when it seemed clear to me that many people voting Brexit were moved by xenophobia and racism. If you get in bed with Farage and Bannon, you'll harm yourself by getting up with fleas

Philip Cardella

@wdlindsy @DoesntExist yep. Anytime you vote looking around to see who you are agreeing with can be instructive.

William Lindsey :toad:

@mouszi The issue to me is that there's a clear choice in the US between fascism and non-fascism.

I'm choosing the non-fascism side.

William Lindsey :toad:

@StrangeCulprits "The whole 'whiteness' argument falls apart in the face of DNA evidence": yes, absolutely. And that point seems so obvious that it's wrily amusing that so many white supremacists seem never to have thought of it. When DNA testing became a "thing" a few decades back, I read reports that so many people in online white supremacist communities were having DNA tests done and finding they had some African blood, that support groups had to be set up for them. Delicious irony.

William Lindsey :toad:

@philip_cardella @DoesntExist Yes. You just don't climb into bed with Trump, Bannon, and Farage and get to claim you're pursuing some noble leftist goals.

Runyan50

@wdlindsy Glad to see Harris addressing the issue with Black men though. The issue with Latinos mystifies me. They will be harrassed, arrested and deported regardless of their citizenship status if Project 2025 is allowed to be implemented. It will be an American Kristallnacht and they seem to be voting it onto themselves like a suicide pact.

Coldoug

@wdlindsy

Yes left politics has this self-defeating hierarchy. Each group dismissive of the other, so unity is extremely unlikely normally speaking.
It's only when a huge issue affects everyone equally badly that they can come together.
Let's be honest, if this election, or more pertinently the aftermath of it, isn't that huge issue then it's difficult to imagine what it would take.

The Monty Python movie Life Of Brian springs to mind, "Judean People's Front - splitters"

William Lindsey :toad:

@beingreal I agree that it's difficult to imagine what it would take. I think therein lies the problem: an inability of many in siloed communities to imagine the humanity of those in other siloed communities.

William Lindsey :toad:

@Runyan50 I agree.