For people who want to leave the US this guide is pretty good.

i think the number they put there (10-15K USD) for a couple is on the low, low end. that's really only if you really know what you're doing and have a direct path. i'd say it's 5x that. at the least.

marrying a citizen of desired nation is also not a sure shot.

there are income requirements for british citizens to sponsor their spouses. many people do not qualify.

like everywhere else, legal immigration is now only for people with money and skills.

and even for people with money and skills, it is one of the hardest things to do.

i don't post this to dissuade anyone, but to reiterate that moving internationally is super super hard from anywhere to anywhere. if you can make it, great.

@skinnylatte sort of unrelated, we used to have a Brazilian couple clean our house (not servants, just professionals like accountants or doctors). They spent so much time and money trying to immigrate here, they finally had enough and using an Italian “law of return” option, the wife moved to Italy. Six months later she brought her husband there and thus the entire EU was accessible.

Oh, and both had MBAs.

in addition, some countries outright block people with disabilities.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cyr70ezev2mo

for trans people, leaving some of the worst transphobic US states for some other countries with less outright transphobia is a good option, but also beware of lack of HRT access and also lack of gender-affirming care in many other countries.

@skinnylatte sounds about right---can be done but there is zero margin for things to go wrong with 10K; let's say flights 2K, airbnb 3k, rent deposits 4k, living expenses for a month 1K (yikes)?

@va2lam yeah i am 5xing it cos i want at least 6 months of living expenses. except for the people with the most skills and experience (and language), you are not going to get a job in six months as a person fresh off the boat and probably without the right papers. + time it takes for european bureaucracy to move, set up a bank account, get internet.

@skinnylatte I've been fortunate in that when I go somewhere on sabbatical I continue to be paid by my employer (at a 15% discount) but have never had to worry about bringing money in.

Even in NZ it took my spouse more than 6 months to get a job, though she wasn't looking immediately. Apart from that, we actually are really good at getting logistics done and that is usually just a week or two.

@revndm birthright citizenship is the only way really.

but even for eu citizens, moving from one country to another can be challenging and expensive. it's easier than for everyone else, but it's still a challenge.

@va2lam Do you really think people will move because of the election results? @skinnylatte

@SeaFury @va2lam the people who can have already gotten second passports and residencies.

many people are not going to be able to qualify or afford it.

@skinnylatte @SeaFury and in our case just due to random world events, although our passports are not US anyhow.

@va2lam I feel a bit removed and privileged from here, it feels so far away. I hope people who need to get away can do so. @skinnylatte

@SeaFury @va2lam the reality is america is many countries in one. a trans person in oklahoma is going to have a very hard time. a queer person in california like me would barely find anywhere else an improvement re safety and opportunity. moving to california may be just as hard as moving to NZ for someone from oklahoma in terms of costs.

@skinnylatte oh yeah, I mean for me it should be easy... white bloke from Australia, skilled migrant to the UK... I've been here 18 years and even now with supposed permanent residence the moving target that is the "hostile environment" still throws us curve-balls and times of anxious uncertainty. Yet I have it _easy_ compared to many.

@yvan yeah i think often of the british citizens from Caribbean backgrounds who have suddenly found out they are not citizens anymore

@skinnylatte @SeaFury @va2lam exactly. We're doing emigration-light and getting out of the south. I've traveled extensively through Europe and Asia for work as an electrical engineer and I just don't think it's feasible or worthwhile to try to leave the US at this point (though that may change). Much more worried about family members who aren't middle aged cis white male engineers like myself.

@skinnylatte
Elseweb, on a blog I read, there was a guy trying to get his wife into the US. (He's a citizen.) Couldn't deal with the never-ending delays and fee demands.

@PJ_Evans yeah getting a spouse into the U.S. from abroad, even from Canada, has been immensely challenging for a long time and far worse under Trump years and prob worsening

@skinnylatte @PJ_Evans Had a friend go through the process, the wait was something like 2 years, during which time the spouse could not go to the US.

@crzwdjk @PJ_Evans it is far easier to walk across the Darien gap and adjust status after. If one survives. People from ‘bad’ countries can take more than 5-15 even longer years with no definitive answers. Married to citizens!