Damn it, #Mastodon subculture has a crap reputation and it’s honestly mostly deserved.
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@loran_hayden what was that experience like?
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I hear you and I hope, it comes soon.
I still wonder why it takes years to implement an extremely useful feature that is common on the other Fediverse platforms and has been left deliberately out of Mastodon for no real reason (Yes, I have read lots and lots of advocacy for the decision not to include quote posts, and the only one that made sense was the personal dislike for it by key members of the development team).
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Apparently I need to provide proof and I’m just some angry Black man. But whatever here’s some sources of negative experiences on #fediverse #mastodon https://social.coop/@nico/105565087137887943 https://drewdevault.com/2022/07/09/Fediverse-toxicity.html https://logicmag.io/policy/blackness-in-the-fediverse-a-conversation-with-marcia-x/ https://fossacademic.tech/2022/12/24/Playvicous-Christmas.html https://roiskinda.cool/2023/12/recuerda-pv-chapter-7-the-dark-and-ugly.html
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@mina To my knowledge, no other fediverse platform (unless you count Bluesky) has moderatable and privacy-friendly quote posts.
The prevalent model is to render a link as a post embed, which gives the quoted person no way to remove themselves from the quote post (except deleting their original post) or to disallow future quotes. Often they don't even get notified that they've been quoted.
As I understand it, adding safety features is where most of the complexity is going.
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I agree, notifying people about there post being quoted (as it was on Twitter) and give the person the possibility to remove their quoted post from the specific re-post are key features, and especially the latter might be technically tricky.
However, truly malicious actors will always be able to use screenshots.
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@mina Definitely true! There is a philosophy among some fediverse developers that we should not try to prevent what we can't truly prevent. If someone is determined to post a copy of your post (that they can see) to their followers, you can't meaningfully stop them.
But I think there is value in friction. We can't prevent all abuse, but we can make it more annoying and time-consuming to be abusive in certain specific ways. The Mastodon team seems to agree with this.
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@julian @mina @damon @fivetonsflax I don't know a lot about this, but I use Mona and it has a quote post option on it. Does this not work like a typical quote post on Twitter/X?
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@mucholucho @mina I don't know how exactly Mona does it. I've seen some clients auto-add a tag for the quoted person next to the quote URL so they at least get a notification.
On Twitter AFAIK you also can't opt out of being quoted except by locking your account, so I guess it's kinda the same?
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@damon I can't speak to the racial component of this, but I can say that I don't find it confusing in the least, and I have no animosity toward users of Bluesky, Nostr or any other federated platform. This may be due, in whole or at least in part, because I have never used any other social media (save Reddit),so I have no expectations of what it is supposed to be like.
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@5teverin0 I can appreciate your perspective. If I can ask, how did you find out about Mastodon? How did you sign up?
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@julian @mina @fivetonsflax @jupiter_rowland does Hubzilla have quote posts with reply controls? I know threads does
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I have some vision and comprehension problems, and I am reading this thread and trying to figure out what it means. I want to know, and frankly I don't want to be attacked for asking. I want to understand you. Is the point of what you are saying that, Mastodon users are racist, BlueSky is better for people of color, and you want people to know that? That is what I got from what I read, but as I mentioned I have some disabilities and want to understand. Thanks.
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@geos @gothodile my point is that Mastodon always is broadcasted as this ethical social network of networks that’s so nice and welcoming. There’s constant attacks on Bluesky and Big Social yet there’s plenty of issues of it’s own that Mastodon and it’s communities need to work on. To this point yes, Bluesky has been better for Black and Brown people, that’s not to say it’s been perfect cause that would be a big lie. But, it did go out its way to empower a Black women to help bolster its network, one of the popular custom feeds is by a Black dev and it’s called Black sky. Ultimately, I want people to hold themselves, their communities and the Mastodon team accountable to help foster an environment that is welcoming and safe for Black and Brown folks. Otherwise, stop pushing a false narrative
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@damon I have no personal experience with Hubzilla, but if https://joinfediverse.wiki/What_is_Hubzilla%3F#Quoting is current info then no, Hubzilla quotes are full text copies that the original poster has no control over. What's more, even if you delete or edit your original post, Hubzilla quotes will stick around with their original content. Different design goals from Twitter-style quote embeds, I assume.
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@matty @CloudyMrs @Sahkshi your response got lost in all of the activity. Thanks for this, of course they’d call a Black man angry for voicing my opinion and wanting improvement. How dare I have any criticisms!
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@damon @NaClKnight Honestly man, the few Black people around here have documented this exhaustively, anyone still asking for proof has got to be on some gaslighting trip
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@damon @gothodile
Bluesky sounds good, then. One thing you brought up is the HOA, and for you that may be annoying, but the only social network I have found that consistently asks people to add alt text is here. If it is not tagged I often can't tell what it is. What is nagging for you is essential to me. Without that, I am often left out. I guess we both found spots that work best for us. Peace!
The only network I actively trash is Xitter (maybe we can agree on that), and I won't stop that . -
damonreplied to George Saich last edited by [email protected]
@geos @goth [email protected] You misunderstood. Alt-text doesn’t nag me. Black and Brown people being told to placed their lives experiences particularly with racism behind a content warning is an issue. Also, Bluesky is big on alt text. One my the followers I’m closest to requires is and mad accessibility advocacy and education his life’s work
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@damon @gothodile
Also, I get the anger. When people don't do simple things that would help me participate I do get mad. Usually, I just let it go, but when someone bitches about being told to use alt text I usually block them, because they clearly don't care about including me.