Some thoughts on Trump's victory

Claire, The Ultimate Worrier

@julieofthespirits it's kind of wild how many of the USA's worst impulses were being kept in check by the presence of the Soviet Union

Sturm und Drag

@waitworry reconstructing western europe and japan on social democratic terms rather than "ha ha we destroyed your infrastructure" like in Iraq was also entirely due to fear of soviet influence! turns out the us can actually do the right thing every once in a while if someone puts the fear of god in them

It's Pronounced DEETS

@julieofthespirits so he's only as racist as those that fought a literal war in order to keep Black people in bondage as property isn't that great of an argument.

Asta [AMP]

@[email protected] @[email protected] This is definitely aimed at the "This isn't us!" type of thinking that tends to crop up now. The reality is, as far as the country goes, Trump really is what the US is. It's a deeply racist segregated country.

Now, a better line of thought might be, "this isn't who we want to be", which I think is true for a lot of people. Part of that is grappling with the truth, which is that the 20th century internal prosperity of the US was an aberration, historically speaking, and limited only to the majority class. So saying "this isn't who we are" glosses over the deep roots, which are things that must be pulled out to reform this country.

At least, that's how I interpreted it.

Sturm und Drag

@aud @PaulDitz yes, basically

Sturm und Drag

@aud @PaulDitz trump is what the us is, the period of racial progress from WWII to Obama was a byproduct of cold war liberalism when the country needed to present a better face to the world and how I feel about it I felt was properly summed up by the "death to America of course" image

Asta [AMP]

@[email protected] @[email protected] That racial progress was hampered as much as possible from the top down, too. So it's not even as if the US made that progress willingly; things just became more insidious (and of course, the "war on drugs" continues to be a slavery pipeline + excuse to try and control Latin America).

The mythologizing of the U.S. past is actively harmful; the state is built on racism, imperialism, exploitation, and has never once moved away from those. The paean of a somehow ideal past just slows things down, at best.

Paul Cantrell

@julieofthespirits
“his racism isn't necessarily *worse* than the average nineteenth century president … it's a level of racism very much in line with the country's history”

Agreed, and for all the pants-on-head nonsense that they spout, I think this particular thing is something that MAGA’s ideological leadership actually understand much •better• than most of the US that’s to the left of MAGA (liberal and leftists alike).

AIF-Massachusetts

@aud @PaulDitz @julieofthespirits

"The mythologizing of the U.S. past is actively harmful"

This . We can't improve our country without acknowledging its harmful past and its origin in racism and colonialism. Any political approach that relies on silencing the history of repression in the US is bound to repeat mistakes.

In addition, pretending that the country has always been great and perfect (aka nationalism) is invalidating to the many, many people and groups who have fought (and are still fighting) to make this place better. The fact that the US has made ANY progress over its history is a testament to the blood, sweat and tears of countless people throwing themselves into the machine and fighting it in every way possible.

Our country's past is a mixed bag and is full of both heinous crimes against humanity and touching moments of inspiration. We need to know the bad parts and learn from the good parts in equal measure in order to move forward.

So yes this is who we are as a country, but not who we *all* are and not who we want to be. We should learn from those who fought before us so we can continue their fight. The US is not great and never was. But we can still keep trying to get it there one step at a time.

It's Pronounced DEETS

@AIF_Massachusetts @aud @julieofthespirits of course she fucking blocked me. What absolute nonsense.

Asta [AMP]

@[email protected] @[email protected] @[email protected] who, the original poster? Maybe it’s because you failed to actually read her post.