Hubzilla has an interesting opportunity right now.

Jupiter Rowland

@dynamic_hubzilla For a native Hubzilla app, there are two premises.

On the one hand, it has to cover all features necessary for "normal" use so that most users will never have to use the Web interface. This means that it will also have to cover almost all configuration.

On the other hand, it must not be too complex. Sure, we could have a Hubzilla app that covers all of Hubzilla. But that would make the app an even bigger monster than it'd be with only the functionality necessary for most people. And some of it would never be needed.

Seriously, how many people would want to use a phone app to build a webpage or edit a wiki on their phone while commuting? With nothing more than two thumbs on a touch keyboard and a teensy-tiny bit of screen left to see what they're typing in the first place?

And what sense does it make for a phone app to cover the settings for the Web interface which isn't even visible in the phone app?

This isn't about reduced functionality in an app because that's how you make apps. This is about leaving features out of the app that literally nobody needs in the app anyway (wiki), also leaving features out of the app that don't even make sense in the app (PDL editor), but at the same time implementing everything that's needed so that the app can be a full stand-in for the Web interface for most people.

hosh

So what's the next phase? Someone can volunteer to build it? Or get a cost estimate then pass around the hat?

Bill Statler

This reminds me of a discussion years ago on a forum for forum administrators. Question: Why are people leaving traditional online forums for Facebook? Answer: Forums work poorly on a smartphone. Question: What can we do about it?

The best answer (in my opinion): Nothing. Forums are inherently designed for long-form posts. Tiny phone screens are NOT designed for long-form posts. Forums assume that the user has an appropriate tool for the task, i.e. a big screen and a keyboard.

So I feel like Hubzilla is in the same situation, but moreso because of all the additional functions. It's convenient to be able to access Hubzilla through a phone, but you wouldn't want to regularly use it that way. I don't even want to use Streams that way, although it works. (I haven't tried Friendica or its app, so I can't comment on that.)

Marshall Sutherland

Tiny phone screens are NOT designed for long-form posts.

I would modify that to say that they are not designed to WRITE long-form posts. A consumer of content might prefer to use their small screen while a creator of content might prefer a large screen. Everyone is going to do some of each, but there may be a large % whose "content" primarily consists of likes and very short replies.

Here is an analogy that comes to mind. Take a more traditional web site with comments. The tools used by the the content creators of the site will be vastly different from viewers and commenters on the site. This is a more extreme case of what I'm trying to point out.

Scott M. Stolz

There are two things at play. Reading and writing.

Facebook and Hubzilla doesn't force you to write long or short posts, so people can post in their preferred style and with as many or as little words as they want.

People who use phones tend to write shorter posts. People who like writing longer posts will prefer a computer to compose posts.

Many people switch back and forth between their desktop/laptop and phone, and for some people, you could probably guess which device they used based on the length of their posts.

People use their phone to read articles and blog posts, and if they are willing to do that, they are probably willing to read longer social media posts, as long as they are interesting. So that is not a show stopper either.

Hubzilla is flexible enough where it can be used for microblogging and/or macroblogging.

𝓒𝓱𝓻𝓲𝓼

i meant nomacs - it's a simple image editor #^https://nomacs.org in contrary to a complex one like GIMP

*_jayrope

@𝓒𝓱𝓻𝓲𝓼 Okay, sadly can't try, no macos installer.

• sent from #Hubzilla at #Fediverse.

𝓒𝓱𝓻𝓲𝓼

@*_jayrope

Okay, sadly can't try, no macos installer.

the point i want to get across is:
Hubzilla is like GIMP = a complex tool with a lot of options

other SM apps are more like nomacs = a good but simple tool with not that much options

You will not please people with GIMP if they are used to something like normacs

Scott M. Stolz

@𝓒𝓱𝓻𝓲𝓼 We're not trying to attract everyone. We are trying to attract people who want more features. And judging by the popularity of Facebook compared to Twitter, and the fact that many Mastodon users mention they want more features, I think Hubzilla will be a good fit for many people, especially with some documentation and some polish.

𝓒𝓱𝓻𝓲𝓼

Following the HZ Project since more than 7 years now that is what i observe:

Since HZ has no appropriate marketing concept engaged users constantly try to communicate that HZ is an alternative to FB like networks. Even so the DEBs started coding because they had in mind to developed such alternatives i truly believe that it does not help the project to finde new follower if the Project is compared to FB / X / Insta and their FEDI copies.

HZ is developed now to something different and Fediverse connectivity is one feature under others.

Streams and forte are the result of this awareness. Some how HZ users seam to have problems to follow this conclusion.

Scott M. Stolz

I did not say we market ourselves as a Facebook clone. I said that many of our features would be attractive to Facebook users.