When I was growing up, I heard lots of talk about Hitler. "How could anyone have listened to that madman rant and have believed what he said?" people would ask, shaking their heads sadly.
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Jargogglesreplied to William Lindsey :toad: last edited by
@wdlindsy
When people are taught about fascism in the US, it's almost end-stage fascism and never what fascism looks like before it has consolidated power. It has very clearly left us vulnerable to the exact kind of bullshit that fascists do and say to take over. -
@wdlindsy @CatDragon Another similarity is how Hitler - like Trump - was seen as a "useful idiot" by other far-right extremists and religious fundamentalists. They lobbied for Hitler to convince Hindenburg to appoint him as Chancellor and became members of his cabinet. They thought they could control him to bring forward their own (still despicable, but yet "less" deadly) agenda.
It resembles much of what we hear these days from evangelical voters when they defend Trump as being "God's tool".
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Huntn00replied to William Lindsey :toad: last edited by
@wdlindsy
This mornings response to Vlad’s Mini-Me, wannabe Der Fuhrer: https://mastodon.world/@Huntn00/113108387854641124 -
Matthew Loxtonreplied to William Lindsey :toad: last edited by
@wdlindsy
Same here - family in WW2, and that sense of how could the Germans be so insane to vote for such a toxic clown of a man, and how could anyone obey such obviously evil commands.Reading Milgram showed me how many "normal" people would obey, but it was always a puzzle about how Hitler gained power in the first place - until Bush the Younger. Then when Trump came, I thought, no, nobody can be so foolish to give this man power, and millions of Americans said "hold my beer"
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William Lindsey :toad:replied to Jargoggles last edited by
@jargoggles This is excellent. I'm boosting it.
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@DP0 @CatDragon Yes, an important parallel. Hitler had the backing of Germany's media elites, its business elites, its military and church leaders, academic leaders: they all thought he'd be controllable once elected.
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Eric Lawtonreplied to William Lindsey :toad: last edited by
I live in Canada.
I learned about Anschluss in history classes; when Hitler annexed Austria with the connivance of Austrian politicians.
We already have some connivers in provincial office, with a federal candidate leading in the polls.
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William Lindsey :toad:replied to Matthias Krämer last edited by
@Kraemer_HB Yes, for a time, talk about parallels with the Nazi period was squelched with "Godwin's law" ridicule. Now, given what Trump is saying openly about mass jailings of his "enemies" and mass deportation of immigrants with blood flowing: how can we possibly refuse to think of Hitler and the Nazi period?
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William Lindsey :toad:replied to Huntn00 last edited by
@Huntn00 Thank you. A very good statement.
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William Lindsey :toad:replied to Matthew Loxton last edited by
@mloxton You're right, Milgram taught us a valuable lesson about the psychodynamics that permit a cruel authoritarian to rise to power relatively unchecked. And his experiment has been duplicated since then at other times and in other social settings, and the results have been dismally the same.
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William Lindsey :toad:replied to Eric Lawton last edited by
@EricLawton Ominous parallels, it seems to me. I cannot forget photos I've seen of the Nazis marching into Austria, with people waving wildly, women throwing flowers at their feet, churchmen standing by the roadside giving Nazi salutes.
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William Lindsey :toad:replied to David Mitchell :CApride: last edited by
@DavidM_yeg Yes, there were Germans who saw Hitler for who he was — no one denies this. As you say, they were often silent, lacking courage, and in that way, helped pave the way for the Nazi era.
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David Mitchell :CApride:replied to William Lindsey :toad: last edited by
Yes, let’s learn from that: the world really needs a lot of loud and courageous people right now.
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KChernecky For Harris 2024replied to William Lindsey :toad: last edited by
@wdlindsy same here
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Arqtecreplied to William Lindsey :toad: last edited by
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Stoneface Vimesreplied to William Lindsey :toad: last edited by
@wdlindsy always well to remember though, that a fair number, at least for a time, were ready to support the British union of fascists and thought "I don't agree with everything that Hitler says but he has some sound ideas". And certainly there was support for Mosley at some quite high levels. Fortunately most cottoned on to it but it may well have gone the other way. Not everyone was an angel - there were some devils too. And I can still remember certain people, not too many admittedly, expressing views not that far removed from Hitler's. There's always been 'something nasty in the woodshed' as aunt Ada Doom would have said.
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William Lindsey :toad:replied to Stoneface Vimes last edited by
@capnthommo Definitely important to remember.
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William Lindsey :toad:replied to Arqtec last edited by
@Arqtec @mloxton Yes — unfortunately, in the U.S., so much hinges on low-information voters who have not been willing to seek much information about these important issues, and who have swallowed misinformation. Coupled with that dynamic is the power of the Electoral College and the Senate, both deeply unrepresentative and anti-democratic entitites, to amplify the voices of those voters.
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William Lindsey :toad:replied to KChernecky For Harris 2024 last edited by
@PeasLuvnJustice Thank you. Definitely heart-breaking.