When I was growing up, I heard lots of talk about Hitler. "How could anyone have listened to that madman rant and have believed what he said?" people would ask, shaking their heads sadly.
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Martin Vermeer FCDreplied to William Lindsey :toad: last edited by
@wdlindsy Only 33% of Germans voted for Hitler... that's a lot better than Trump's 46-47%. Perhaps the difference is that the corporate media is largely 'gleichgeschaltet' already before the election.
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Catherine is Tired and Crankyreplied to William Lindsey :toad: last edited by
@wdlindsy people are hearing what they want hear as told by some politicians and media outlets. The message is in most cases subtle. That it is “those other people” preventing them from being successful and prosperous. Fascism flourishes under the false premise that its followers will indeed be the chosen ones that will not suffer under it.
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William Lindsey :toad:replied to Catherine is Tired and Cranky last edited by
@CatDragon Yes, that's right — and this is exactly parallel to what happened as Hitler rose to power in Germany.
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William Lindsey :toad:replied to Martin Vermeer FCD last edited by
@martinvermeer I think the percentage garnered by the Nazis in 1933 was 43.9%. I'd also note that the German media, Germany's economic and business leaders, its church leaders and military leaders, played a very large role in helping Hitler come to power, all assuming they could control him once he was in office.
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Martin Vermeer FCDreplied to William Lindsey :toad: last edited by
@wdlindsy Wasn't that already after the Nazis were in control? About the final coup, yes, that's precisely how it went. Also a warning for today.
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David Mitchell :CApride:replied to William Lindsey :toad: last edited by
There were many Germans who did see Hitler for who he was, but weren’t willing or able or organized to act until it was too late, and so got dragged along by their neighbours into the horrors of Nazi Germany, trying to keep their heads down and survive.
This is not apologia for them but an indictment, and a warning to today: organize, act, stand against those neighbours and do it now before it is too late. -
Fragarachreplied to William Lindsey :toad: last edited by
I watched "Good" at a simulcast (I think that's the term), and it was a riveting exposure of how disinformation (also known as propaganda) can alter the views of otherwise "reasonable" people:
https://www.standard.co.uk/culture/theatre/good-harold-pinter-theatre-review-david-tennant-chillingly-plausible-b1032344.html -
Piousunynreplied to William Lindsey :toad: last edited by
@wdlindsy One can say the conservative value, has a superiority complex, and utilizes it to feel superior over any people of difference? Takes a certain kind of person to hate difference?
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Matthias Krämerreplied to William Lindsey :toad: last edited by
@wdlindsy A few years ago, "serious" people would have scolded you for comparing Trump to Hitler. I doubt that is still the case. Maybe here in Germany, where Hitler is seen as unique by some that want do deny anything similar could happen again.
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Pom_is_tiredreplied to Matthias Krämer last edited by
@Kraemer_HB @wdlindsy
Our regional newspaper recently (this summer) ran an editorial telling people to stop writing letters to the editor using the words “Hitler” and “Nazis”, because they don’t approve and won’t print them. The paper is a shadow of its former self, but I was surprised by this. Apparently the editor is fine with letters calling Harris communistic or a socialist though. -
Matthias Krämerreplied to Pom_is_tired last edited by
@pomegranate_stew @wdlindsy There is "Godwin's law", but then again, it does not prohibit something comparable to Hitler or the Nazis to be rightly compared. That's what your newspaper does, maybe with the German-style uniqueness in mind.
But that the newspaper published an editorial about that question sounds to me as if the Nazi comparisons in their letters were abundant by now. I wonder whom the readers favored as Hitler-lookalike. -
crazyeddiereplied to William Lindsey :toad: last edited by
@wdlindsy Huh. My parents encouraged me to learn just how horrible he was and why...but growing up, if he was mentioned at all outside an educational setting, I more often heard how he was actually good for Germany. 99.9999% wouldn't even mention him...but those who did...
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Jargogglesreplied to William Lindsey :toad: last edited by
@wdlindsy
When people are taught about fascism in the US, it's almost end-stage fascism and never what fascism looks like before it has consolidated power. It has very clearly left us vulnerable to the exact kind of bullshit that fascists do and say to take over. -
@wdlindsy @CatDragon Another similarity is how Hitler - like Trump - was seen as a "useful idiot" by other far-right extremists and religious fundamentalists. They lobbied for Hitler to convince Hindenburg to appoint him as Chancellor and became members of his cabinet. They thought they could control him to bring forward their own (still despicable, but yet "less" deadly) agenda.
It resembles much of what we hear these days from evangelical voters when they defend Trump as being "God's tool".
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Huntn00replied to William Lindsey :toad: last edited by
@wdlindsy
This mornings response to Vlad’s Mini-Me, wannabe Der Fuhrer: https://mastodon.world/@Huntn00/113108387854641124 -
Matthew Loxtonreplied to William Lindsey :toad: last edited by
@wdlindsy
Same here - family in WW2, and that sense of how could the Germans be so insane to vote for such a toxic clown of a man, and how could anyone obey such obviously evil commands.Reading Milgram showed me how many "normal" people would obey, but it was always a puzzle about how Hitler gained power in the first place - until Bush the Younger. Then when Trump came, I thought, no, nobody can be so foolish to give this man power, and millions of Americans said "hold my beer"
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William Lindsey :toad:replied to Jargoggles last edited by
@jargoggles This is excellent. I'm boosting it.
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@DP0 @CatDragon Yes, an important parallel. Hitler had the backing of Germany's media elites, its business elites, its military and church leaders, academic leaders: they all thought he'd be controllable once elected.
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Eric Lawtonreplied to William Lindsey :toad: last edited by
I live in Canada.
I learned about Anschluss in history classes; when Hitler annexed Austria with the connivance of Austrian politicians.
We already have some connivers in provincial office, with a federal candidate leading in the polls.