@GreenFire @chris

Susan Kaye Quinn 🌱(she/her)

that's my take as well

particularly airplane travel will be *very* hard to decarbonize and the only realistic path (right now) is green H2, but the FF industry is pushing "sustainable aviation fuel" which is just more FF/biofuel. THAT is what FF wants, so demonizing H2 works there.

As for trucks, the fastest growing segment of US automakers is *commercial* EVs — small trucks/vans, but Pepsi just deployed a fleet of EV big trucks.

Air travel remains the hardest nut to crack

Kevin Leecaster

@susankayequinn @chris
I am a fan of biofuels as an interim measure to stop burning fossil fuels when people fly since it is clear that people are unwilling to stop flying until any newer technology would allow them to do it sustainably.

Getting new passenger planes certified and considered safe enough by consumers is going to take quite a while I expect.

Chris Alemany🇺🇦🇨🇦🇪🇸

@GreenFire @susankayequinn I honestly don't think air travel will be a thing outside of trans-oceanic in 20-50 years. There are far cheaper and more efficient ways to move people over continents (high speed rail).

Once the shit hits the fan repeatedly (much more than today), and thousands of people die from climate change disasters on a regular basis, governments will look to how to very quickly reduce unnecessary fossil fuel use.

Air Travel will be the top of the list.

Susan Kaye Quinn 🌱(she/her)

@GreenFire flight is a tough problem, but I see so much greenwashing with biofuels and people just really not understanding how bad they are.

I don't think the switch over to H2 powered flight will be as difficult as you think--electric planes might take longer. (I used to design aircraft engines, but I'm no expert on this)

The real answer is to cut down on flying--tax the fuck out of private jets (or ban them, like just don't LET THEM LAND) and restrict business flights.

@chris

Chris Alemany🇺🇦🇨🇦🇪🇸

@susankayequinn @GreenFire biofuels, like the current "hydrogen economy”, is just an excuse to continue the status quo. They offer very little, if any, actual benefit as far as CO2 emissions (you're still emitting—carbon ‘offsets' are tenuous at best) and were the air industry to become dependent on biofuels as a main source of fuel, then we run into a conflict between flying and growing food.

I know which one I'd be on the streets to fight for.

Susan Kaye Quinn 🌱(she/her)

@chris not just growing food (which is mostly for animals) — they would actively cut down forests. This is already being done to feed the hunger for "biofuels" elsewhere. Plus the AMOUNT that we would need for flight is just... massive

It's really *not* a stopgap solution. It's a way to avoid regulating/reducing flight.

And everyone starts with our current flying as some kind of baseline that won't change but flights are *increasing*...

@GreenFire

Chris Alemany🇺🇦🇨🇦🇪🇸

@susankayequinn @GreenFire precisely.

Kevin Leecaster

@chris @susankayequinn
Nice discussion, yes we need an all-of-the-above approach to get the climate action we need in the short time we've left ourselves to achieve it.

One thing that bothers me about the cynical approach towards discussing global warming is that it feels to me that it can cause people to give up which is the opposite of what we need now.

Kevin Leecaster

@chris @susankayequinn
For example, the recent reporting about our emissions gap have pretty much entirely neglected to point out that when Paris was signed we were on track for five degrees of warming and we've managed to bring that down to three degrees.

Obviously we need to do much better, but not acknowledging how much good we have accomplished seems to send a signal that we have no hope.

I think the fossil fuel industry wants us to have no hope so that we'll remain their customers.

Susan Kaye Quinn 🌱(she/her)

@GreenFire exactly

we've made huge progress in convincing the majority of the world's population (even America) that climate change is happening and humans are the cause

Now we need to be savvy about how to get everyone in the fight, even in a small (but real) way. To not be a doomer (the new denier). To understand that everything matters.

I'm a firm believer that once people start taking action, they will do MORE. Plus the climate will continue to apply more pressure.

@chris