Idly wondering as I run the Ubuntu 24.10 upgrade on my primary workstation what's going to end up broken this time
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@jalefkowit I have one last Ubuntu machine, but if and when the time comes to replace it, it won't be Ubuntu again.
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Also after the 24.10 upgrade it looks like most of my custom apt sources are just... gone? Not "commented out until I update them," the way old apt sources usually are after an update. Just... missing. Totally not there.
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@neil @jalefkowit May I ask what it will be? I too am beginning to lose patience with Ubuntu, and ideally, I'm after something with the convenience of Ubuntu but without the inconvenience of, er, Ubuntu. What are the cool kids running these days?
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I've no idea what the cool kids are running, but I'm on Debian.
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@conniptions @neil If you put a gun to my head and asked me to choose a distro right now, it would probably be Fedora.
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@neil @conniptions My understanding is that the cool kids these days are into immutable distros. I tend to let other people be the guinea pigs for big new ideas, though
What is immutable Linux? Here's why you'd run an immutable Linux distro
Safety and security are immutable Linux's calling cards.
ZDNET (www.zdnet.com)
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@jalefkowit ugh how could they have screwed their OS up so much. I run Ubuntu 22 on an old laptop that serves as a Jellyfin server and docker server so I don’t interact with it often. All other Linux machines are running Pop! OS and knock on wood ok so far.
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@andymoose I would never have imagined 20 years ago that I would be very happy running Ubuntu on servers and very unhappy running Ubuntu on desktops. Yet here we are
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@jalefkowit @neil @conniptions I’m also in the Debian camp. It’s minimally harder than Ubuntu to set up. But once that’s done, I’ve found Debian Stable to be reassuringly boring.
I can just get on with my work, rather than constantly messing with the system.
(Caveat: it’s clearly not the right choice for people who always want the latest version of things.)
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@slothrop @jalefkowit @conniptions
I stick with Debian Stable for some stuff, and Debian Testing for other systems.
So far - four years - I've found Debian Testing to be pretty darned stable (in the every day sense of the term), but with more up to date packages.
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@neil @slothrop @conniptions That tracks with what I've heard, too. The days when running Debian Testing meant living on the razor's edge seem to be behind us
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And the ones that _are_ still there, apt seems not to be checking? Like, "apt update" pings the standard Ubuntu sources, but none of the custom ones that remain.
Now if you will excuse me, I need to bang my forehead on my desk until my brains fall out
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Jason Lefkowitzreplied to Jason Lefkowitz last edited by [email protected]
Oh goody, it looks like Debian changed apt's file format for custom sources. This means that any sources using the old one-line format wouldn't work.
Which is presumably why Ubuntu just threw all of mine out, even if it would have been much nicer of them to rewrite them into the new format for me
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I am learning a lot more about apt today than I wanted to.
So the old one-line apt format still works, BUT, you have to use it in a file with the extension .list. The new DEB822 format goes into files with the extension .sources.
You CAN mix and match these formats, but only if you give each type of file the appropriate extension. If you use one format or the other with the wrong extension, things break.
(Which now brings me back to the question of where my old one-line .list files went. Sigh.)
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@[email protected] it's not like it's a downstream distribution that does planned releases and specific upgrade paths so they could have ensured this didn't happen or anything.
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@[email protected] so, yeah, this has historically been my experience with Ubuntu release upgrades. I'm always confused when I meet someone who says it works, because it is always this type of scenario.
(for the record, it was indeed enough to make me ditch Ubuntu, especially when I was responsible for keeping the undergrad student lab desktops updated in our group. They basically died every semester). -
@[email protected] Do they not keep a mapping/graph of package changes and functionality, etc? If for whatever reason the luks functionality required is now in that package...
Then again, who knows about Ubuntu is actually doing with .deb nowadays, since half the .deb files are just wrappers around snaps. -
@jalefkowit how did it work out, brother?
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@openbuddha Not great. Scroll down the thread
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@jalefkowit oh jeez. When I rebuilt my last Framework laptop, I did a new installation and forgot to turn on Luks. I’m not sure that was a bad mistake now.
