Some important reminders of history and the reality of our society’s power structures in this thread from @seachanger:
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"Dear Dr." ionizedgirlreplied to Paul Cantrell last edited by
@inthehands this is a lot more well said version of what I've been saying: "everyone around here acting like they just realized politicians are bad"
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yeah. probably more "actual solutions are pretty low in the priority queue". it's not that they are against fixing things. it's just not what they put as a top goal.
that's why if we can give them a "story" they think they can run with to go with actual solutions, we'll get more actual solutions.
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@inthehands This is a really important distinction that it would be helpful if more people understood and you've done a great job outlining it. I am someone who is sometimes activist and sometimes politician and am slightly disappointed that more people don't seem to understand the jobs and wind up indignant about whatever it is that I am doing.
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@paul_ipv6
I still think you’re giving politicians far, far too little credit. It’s this:partial solutions for which there is consensus > better solutions that don’t have consensus
Your fixation on giving politicians a “story” isn’t about convincing •them•. It’s about helping them convince others. And for some actual solutions, no story is going to create the consensus in the current moment. That’s where activism comes in.
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@vashbear
I share this frustrations. Harris’s job is to find an avenue for speaking as much of the truth of the genocide as she can while not costing herself the chance to do something about it. She had spoken quite forcefully about the situation in the past (https://hachyderm.io/@inthehands/112855326366406933) and I hope she finds a way at the DNC. But I also understand the tradeoffs she faces trying to embed that in what is fundamentally a giant infomercial. -
@donaldball
Part of what leftists like about folks like Bernie and AOC and Omar (my rep!) is their solidly left-leaning constituencies mean that they can simultaneously be politicians at home while being activists on the House/Senate floor. And I do really appreciate them speaking my truths into the congressional record! But we need to recognize that being national activists the way they are is simply not a choice available with every congressional constituency. -
"It thus follows that politicians and political parties are •lagging• indicators of change."
i think that's a crucial part of understanding where politicians are in the process of substantive, systemic change.
they are the original "no one ever got fired for buying X" folks.
you're right that politicians don't build consensus. they don't even lobby hard for it. they concede to consensus when they believe it's consensus.
the reason they need a story is to understand how what they're trying to do matches that consensus opinion.
politicians are sales folks as much as they are legislators.
what you call activists are the startups, the market disruptors, the visionaries.
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Paul Cantrellreplied to "Dear Dr." ionizedgirl last edited by
@ionizedgirl
One of my brings-the-knives-out opinions is that politicians are on average far better human beings than we generally imagine. (And yes, many are grifters, con artists, sociopaths, reprehensible humans — but far fewer than we imagine.) There’s a whole lot of decent and well-meaning people in politics; it’s the job itself that’s a bastard. -
@paul_ipv6
Yeah, I often compare activism to R&D.A mistake we often make speaking to politicians is imagining we understand where consensus lies better than they do. Occasionally we do, but rarely. This is their job. If they’ve survived in it long, they’re probably good at it. We live in bubbles; they hear the whole cross-section.
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@jessamyn
I don’t think I truly understood all of what I wrote above until I’d had a taste of being in both roles (not in electoral politics, but within companies / orgs). Another crucial one I didn’t work into the thread is “diplomat.” -
@inthehands I've been considering this a lot more recently b/c we're doing tax appeal hearings after a town wide reappraisal. I chair a board that oversees these. The biggest taxpayer (community health center) grieved their appraisal (which is their right) & brought a lawyer. She showed up, acted all lawyerly and was downright rude. She was getting paid, I was a civic volunteer. People need to understand the power dynamics of the people they are interacting with in order to understand the system
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@inthehands Great stuff! It quantitizes what's technically much more fuzzy--a politician can and will engage in activisim; the best activism takes political realities to some degree into account (and in fact the DNC protests do hit that somewhat given that many of the protestors are also deligates--a political role), so much of this is technically on a continuum.
But the heart of it is that wielding real democratic power constrains your actions and not doing so to an extent leaves you freer.
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@jessamyn
Uff da, as the Minnesotans say. What a miserable situation.That seems like a situation where the lawyer is exercising power at the expense of diplomacy: to the extent that she can threaten you or the town with real harm, the threats are effective; to the extent that she needs city gov’s consensus and understanding, she’s self-sabotaging.
Here’s hoping you and the town make it through that process intact.
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jz.tuskreplied to "Dear Dr." ionizedgirl last edited by
Just go vote for Trump, and enjoy the next administration.
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@mneme
Yes, a continuum. One thing that’s important to appreciate is that when somebody occupies both roles or slides between them, when a politician can also be an activist, that is •situational• and not solely a matter of personal integrity, e.g.: https://hachyderm.io/@inthehands/113007433707353356 -
Paul Cantrellreplied to Paul Cantrell last edited by [email protected]
Here's a great example of the activist-politician handoff in action, from @jztusk:
https://mastodon.social/@jztusk/113007506440716149(Yes, Obama didn’t directly enact marriage equality, but his executive choices such as extending federal employee benefits to same-sex partners in 2010, plus his SCOTUS noms, plus his public change to supporting same-sex marriage, all helped set up Obergefell.)
Was Obama lying before? or after? Or did he truly change his mind? …Does it make a difference? Not to the result!
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@inthehands I listened to a really interesting interview with sen. Butler who went from activist to politician in a really sudden way. And she spoke about how more close relationships between the two would be more efficient, pointing to MLK and LBJ.
Def worth a listen.
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@Jackiemauro
Sounds really interesting. The MLK/LBJ relationship is an extreme and classic example! -
@inthehands Thank you, I think we will, but the next hearing we're all in I will take more care to remind her that we're all working on the same result (a fair price) and she is paid while we are not and she should be mindful of that. The worst possible outcome is that they grieve it to the state and then I *think* it's out of our hands and not actually worse for the town. We're just all trying, cooperatively, to keep the state's lawyers out of it because it costs the state money.
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@jztusk
What? Where is this coming from?
@ionizedgirl @inthehands