@fluffy Awesome!!

The technical details get really nerdy, but I got this issue sorted out a week or two ago. So if you had trouble following in the past, the universal solution “turn it off, then turn it on again” works.

@fluffy Yup. And unfortunately, following Mastodon is our near-future, too

But..

As more services come online, we can change the paradigm. Bandwagon is an example of using Mastodon as a “notifications-only” channel, while keeping richer interactions (like listening to music, making playlists, etc) on the more specialized server.

@fluffy Go get it. I’ll love to see it when it’s done!

@[email protected] @[email protected] As far as “why on the Fediverse?”

I think we’re still undervaluing the ability to follow, like, and boost on an open network -- mostly because Fediverse 1.0 has worked so hard to mirror corporate social media.

But there is more power in artists’ hands if everything happens on the open web. I believe you can reach more people, with fewer intermediaries, and retain more control when your “social graph” isn’t tied to a single server.

We’ll have to build it to find out 🥸

@[email protected] @[email protected] Hmm.. I followed your bandwagon profile from mastodon.social. And, I’ve just closed the loop with “secure mode” servers, so you SHOULD be able to follow. I can try making a test account on your server if you’re still having trouble.

@fluffy This is 100% true. My hands won’t move fast enough on the keyboard to make it happen any sooner.

Artists should be able to sell their work online without paying an additional cut to their landlord. Use your own PayPal or Strip account and get paid directly.

As soon as SOMEONE does this, nearly everyone will have to follow.

It’ll be glorious

@fluffy I’d love to see the site you end up with!

One of my goals for search and discovery is to cross app boundaries, so (hypothetically) a Bandwagon genre search could pull up results from Faircamp, Mirlo, or others.

I’ll have to get permission, of course, but I’d love to figure out how to index your site too.

@fluffy This makes sense, and it’s super helpful. Thank you.

It sounds like some of the missing pieces from the roadmap will help fill in the gaps - like tags, discovery, search, and online sales. You’re right that it’s an incomplete solution (for now)

I also have a ticket to make it easier to get started - for instance reading metadata from mp3s to populate your album data. But omg, reading mp3 metadata is sooo awful, so that part is just gonna be slow.

@[email protected]@plush.city Thats really good to hear. What would you say doesn’t match for independent musicians?

Not trying to hijack your post, but I’m the solo developer building Bandwagon. I want it to be a community-driven project that bends to different people’s needs, so I’d love to hear where you think it’s a mismatch, or where it’s falling down.

And, I’ll be happy to help promote Bandcrash and any other solutions for artists, in addition to mine The more the better!

@fluffy @mirlo Awesome!

It feels like the season of music on the open web, and the more people working on this, the better.

I think Bandcamp has nearly prefected the formula: good artist discovery, custom profiles, and easy online sales. Just open up the network and the payment processors, and there's your product spec. It's all musicians ask for.

Keep an eye on bandwagon.fm, too. There's no album sales yet, but it should be a solid Bandcamp alternative when Paypal payments land in 2025.

@AeonCypher @gerrymcgovern - Yes, these are all very good examples, and there are countless more, unfortunately, of how technology needs to do better.

I think I just want to reserve labels like "white supremacist" for the real assholes out there, and not dilute this with other problems like the laziness, ignorance, incompetence, rushed timelines, and capitalist greed that (probably?) are behind the AI failures discussed by Wired.

Following you to try keeping up

@gerrymcgovern

So, white supremacy is bad. All forms of hate are wrong. It shouldn’t need to be said.

I have to ask, though: “AI is designed by white supremacists” seems like a huge logical leap. Yes, big tech has plenty of problems, but it hurts the fight against white supremacy if we blame every.. single.. problem on it -- because this rhetoric dilutes the core message and undercuts the credibility behind the fight by turning away the middle-ground people it should be reaching.

@wjmaggos @ill_logic @musicman @ryno @friendsofccmusic

Yes! Great summary. And I am copying Wordpress’es business model on purpose. I think it’s a fair an open way to cover all the bases.

One note: Bandwagon WILL support online album sales, but doesn’t yet. It’s on the roadmap (https://bandwagon.fm/roadmap) but will take some time to do well.

@ill_logic @wjmaggos

I’ll go out on a limb and say, from what I’ve seen, subvert.fm is a plan without a technology stack (yet?)

And bandwagon is a technology stack without a plan

It’s slightly better than that, but Bandwagon started off as a response to musicians’ requests.

Once I run out of feature and enhancement requests, I’m not sure what I’ll do next.

Here's my announcement about Mastodon's "Secure Mode" (aka "Authorized Fetch")

Here's my announcement on Bandwagon:
https://bandwagon.fm/6717d47dbbaef81a027f918a

I don't really like particular part of the technology stack (or the reasoning behind it) but it's important to implement so that artists' work is as widely available as possible.

@ill_logic

I'm gonna blame Mastodon (mostly) for not backfilling things. It's certainly possible to browse someone's existing library (or outbox) to see what they've posted in the past.

At scale, it's just a really hard task, so I think they made the decision to only import data from when they start following you.

@clifmo @phishnet

To answer this better, if you have the copyright holder's permission to post their work, then that should be enough.

Certainly, it's ok for a band's agent to post their stuff on their behalf.

I'll update the TOS to better reflect this.

@ill_logic Yeah, Mastodon doesn't give us a lot of room to display custom profile stuff.

However, new posts (like album releases, events, and news items) do show up in followers' Mastodon feeds.

If you've got suggestions on how to get Mastodon to show album info (and other "permanent library" -type information) I'm eager to figure this out.

@clifmo Gotcha, yes. The TOS is very "non-legalese" at the moment, but I want to make sure we're respecting musicians rights and copyrights out of the gate.

@ill_logic One more thought: We may be able to *read* from Funkwhale sooner than we can *write* to it.

My goal for the discovery/search project is to see if we can index Funkwhale sites (among others) as a first step to unifying all the music on the Fediverse.